Planning First Cycle....

[Tyler]

Hi All -

I am planning my first cycle and would like to run some particulars by you for feedback. First some info about me (apologies for the length):

• Age: 44
• Wt: 170
• Ht: 6' 0"
• BF: 7% (3-pt caliper test puts me at 5.1% but don't think I'm that low; definitely sub-10%)

Training History: I was skinny-fat and not very athletic in my teens. Got into lifting in college and early 20s, then a long layoff until 30. Looked ok, but weight always around 170 as I was too chicken-shit to commit to a true bulk or cut for fear of gaining too much fat or losing too much muscle. In my late 30s I decided to go on a real 'bulk' and see it through. Did SS and gained about 25 lbs, probably half of it fat. Then did a true cut before my 40th. Lost almost nothing but fat and saw my abs for the first time. Have stayed relatively lean since but weight is always around 170.

I was diagnosed with Low T in 2009 (age 37) and put on HCG monotherapy. T levels came up but then started dropping; doc (ND) wanted to keep upping my dose but I wasn’t comfortable with that so I found a new doc that would prescribe T. Was put on T-Cyp 100mg/week and I supplemented with HCG and Adex on my own (still do). So for the last several years I’ve been on:

• T-Cyp: 100mg/wk (50mg x2)
• HCG: 750iu/wk (250iu MWF)
• Adex: .24mg/wk (2 drops 3x/wk) - I know this is very little but my E2 holds steady at 19 (range 0 - 39) at this dose.

* I have also been on 1.25mg/day finasteride for hairloss for about 10 years.​

Current: Going to Hawaii in a couple weeks and have been cutting for the past three months.... mostly low-carb, around 2,100 cals/day with some cheat meals/days mixed in. I have upped my T-cyp dosage to 200mg/wk for the past 8 weeks. As I know I am going to do some damage while on vacation, I plan to resume my current diet/routine for a couple weeks or so to get back to where I am now and then reverse diet to my TDEE.


Plan: I have always looked "top heavy" and I want to go on a leg specialization program to add some size to the wheels. I intend to put upper body on maintenance and hit legs hard for 10 weeks. So that's where the cycle comes in.


Cycle - 10 weeks:

• T-Prop: 300mg/wk (100mg MWF)
• NPP: 300mg/wk (100mg MWF)
• HCG: 750iu/wk (250iu MWF)
• Adex: ???

*Caber will be on hand if needed and I also picked up some Synthelamin based on a post of Magnus’.​

The reason I chose the above is because I am prone to hair loss (MPB) and, at 44, it ain’t getting better. Also, while I want to see some good results from this, I want to choose a relatively safe cycle since it’s my first one.


Post-Cycle: Just return immediately to my TRT regimen.


Questions:

1. Do my cycle choices, dosage and duration look ok, or should I do something different?
2. Any suggestions on how much Adex I should use while on?
3. Should I up my finasteride to ward off additional hair loss?
4. Any other supps I should use while on or other sides to watch out for?

TL;DR: is 10 weeks of T-prop (300mg/wk), NPP (300mg/wk), HCG & Adex a good beginner’s cycle for someone one TRT who is concerned with hair loss?

Apologies again for the long post. Thanks for any feedback.

- T

 

[Tyler]

I guess I'll assume that my plan isn't completely retarded since I figure someone would have told me so by now.

 

[aon1]

I figured someone else would chime in but
Question 1 this is something you need to see through experimentation to see what works for you, go by bloodwork,side effects ,gains act. and adjust accordingly.Me personally I like running longer than 10 weeks

2 only way to get this dialed in for you personally is to do bloodwork while on and adjust as needed.

3 I don't know anything about finastride but at your age if your prone and going to run gear affectively just shave the head, cue ball up and accept being shiny on top...lol

4 I run bcaa's ,donate blood regularly, do bloodwork often,depending what and how high I'm running I may run low dose asprin ,I watch blood pressure and cholesterol if I see a problem I supplement accordingly. I always try to run as little extra shit as possible if my bloods arnt telling me I need it then its just more uneeded shit and strain on the system.

There's better guys here to answer these questions that may chime in but that's my two cents good luck

 

[GetSwullll]

Even with the TrT most first cycles are the base Test foundation of a long ester Test Cyp/E at 500mgs per week..10-12 weeks. Though 300mgs NPP will provide some joint relief, which may be relative, before I throw a second compound in on first cycle, I'd kick an oral in at the beginning, maybe Dbol at 30mgs a day..6 weeks at start of cycle. Again, this basis of first cycle history but someone more familiar with TrT will chime in I'm sure. Welcome to the board.

 

[Tyler]

Thank you both for the replies. Aon1: understood about the hair (lol) but I'm not quite ready to jump off that bridge just yet. My hair is thinning on top but not really receding that much. I won't let it get to the point where I am embarrassing myself (comb-over, etc.); I will shave it it comes to that. But I want to feel things out on a first cycle, I am not committing to one cycle after another. But your point is well understood.

GW: I am happy to do Test Cyp or E instead, I thought perhaps a shorter ester would be desirable. I have had no problems with Cyp thus far; I could just up the dosage of that to 500mgs/wk. Regarding Dbol, I was trying to steer clear of ones that might accelerate hair loss and I've read that quite a few people have experienced rapid shedding with it.

Regarding blood work, not sure if it's ok to ask this here, but do you recommend one testing lab/service over another? I am in the states and have used LEF before, but since I am on TRT my doc has been running everything. I am not comfortable bringing him into the fold on this right now but might if I was going to continue.

Lastly, with regard to donating blood, I have been told in the past that my blood would not be accepted because of being on TRT and finasteride. Last time I donated (10+ years ago) I remember a check box on the form that said "Do not use my blood" (I imagine for those that do not want to admit something after reading through the requirements). How do you handle this?

Thanks again.

 

[Magnus82]

Good info here Taylor. I would suggest a long ester test as well. Test c or e would be fine, 500/wk for 12 weeks. Adex at 1mg/day sold be OK but watch for signs of high estro. I'd skip the npp for now and possibly include it for your next cycle. Consider logging it here so we can help out with any problems or questions you may have. Good luck!

 

[Tyler]

Thanks Magnus. Ok, so you suggest a T-only cycle for 12 weeks. Regarding adex, currently I take .25mg per week and my E2 stays right at 19 (range 0 - 39). Do you still suggest that high of dose (7mg/wk)?

And I assume I should continue with my HCG at 250iu 3x/wk?

 

[Sully]

If you're already using Test for TRT, just keep things simple and stick with the same ester you already have. Switching to shorter esters isn't going to get you anything except more injections. Also, there's no need for HCG for someone that is on TRT already. HCG prevents you from getting completely shut down and helps you recover more quickly during PCT. Being on TRT means you're already shut down and since you're going to go straight back to TRT, it isn't going to speed up anything. And use Aromasin/Exemestane instead of Arimidex, 12-25mg daily. We have a really good supplier of pharmaceutical grade ancillaries called Clearsky Pharmacy. Good luck and let us know how your cycle goes.

 

[squatster]

Test P sucks for first cycle- It just hurts, and why would you want that on your first cycle
Sorry for the delay with every one- the boards just arn't very active lately.
Good thing- you got the best guys letting you know what to do

 

[Tyler]

Good info; thanks guys.

Sully, the reason I use HCG is to keep the testes running a bit. It's a pretty standard protocol to run T, low-does HCG and an AI for TRT....unfortunately most doctors don't know shit about it and prescribe T only and shots once every two weeks. That's essentially chemical castration...not to mention the testes shrivel up (I don't need any help there).

I inject T-cyp twice/wk and use HCG 3x/wk at 250iu each (so 750/wk). It's relatively economical and I would prefer to just keep that same protocol while on cycle unless there is some specific reason not to.

Again, I appreciate all of the feedback.

 

[Sully]

I'm not saying you shouldn't use it, just that it's not necessary. If your doc prescribes it and you have it on hand, by all means keep going. It's just a necessity is all. I prefer to keep the number of compounds I use during any cycle to a bare minimum.

 

[AR-15]

HCG can cause havoc on you if its overused brother. You got good advice from pretty smart guys here and I can tell just by what you wrote that you know what works for you. All I'm saying is be careful with it. As far as hairloss and d -bol. I personally think the benefits out way the risks running dbol in a test only cycle. Dbol is a great oral to run with test and if hairloss is a huge concern even when running dbol for just six weeks you could always add one of many hairloss products that would ease your mind....AR....

 

[Tyler]

Thanks AR. I am already on finasteride (Propecia) and minoxidil (Rogaine). One of my questions was actually whether I should up the dosage of finasteride while on cycle (currently taking 1.25mg/day).

 

[squatster]

Leave the Propecia were you have it.
With out your HCG you will not notice a difference at all until you go to a gram or 2 pr week of test after months.
Short blasts of Dbal won't do any thing to your hair -
Worrying about it will

 

[Tyler]

Alright so it sounds like the consensus is to run:

- T-cyp at 500mg/wk (weeks 1 - 12)
- Dbol at 30mg/day (weeks 1 - 6)*
- Stop HCG during, then resume my TRT protocol of T-cyp (100mg/wk) and HCG (750mg/wk) at completion (so week 13).

*For Dbol, the supplier I was looking at using offers only 50mg tablets, so I am assuming cutting in half and running 25mg/day will work. Let me know if that's not ok.

Also, the AI dosages people are suggesting are waaaay higher than what I run now (only 0.25mg/wk). I am a bit reluctant to instantly jump into 12 - 25mg/day. But if you guys say that's the way to do it, I will. I have had my E2 crash before and it's no fun (I know neither is the alternative).

 

[Tyler]

Shit...I just realized there's some info I forgot to divulge. While I don't have "high blood pressure" per se, it is always right over the cusp of 120/80 when I go see the doctor. I think I have the opposite of white-coat syndrome: when I test at home I usually get in the 140s/80s (sometimes higher) but I typically see lower at the doctor's office and they have never expressed concern about it (I have brought it up before).

I seemed to have only written down two readings at the doctor, in 2013 & 2014. They were 136/84 and 140/84, respectively.

Sorry for the oversight. My father has been on very low-dose BP meds for decades and it is totally under control. That is the only family history I have.

 

[Tyler]

Been gone on vacation and just thought I would bump this once to see if there's any feedback on my last post re blood pressure. Been taking it at home and it is averaging 145/82 (not 100% sure on the accuracy of this monitor; it tends to be lower when the nurse takes it).

 

[Sully]

Automatic BP monitors tend to be u reliable. Usually they run high. I'd go with the numbers your doctor gets. If he's not concerned about your BP, you probably don't need to be either. Just keep an eye on it while you're on cycle. If it starts to creep up, go to the doc and see if he wants you on BP meds.

 

[Tyler]

Right on Sully. Thanks.

 

[ctysgcngay17]

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